Last updated on 6th April 2017
[Ravi Note: About me referring to Muddenahalli group supporters as Madhu Baba devotees (MBDs): As Muddenahalli group considers it their freedom of speech right to openly broadcast on Internet and PUBLISH printed documents & books with words of Madhusudan Rao Naidu (Madhu Baba) as Sathya Sai Baba's words, I consider that I am being fair and ethical (Dharmic) in labeling Madhusudan Rao Naidu as Madhu Baba and his followers as Madhu Baba devotees. end-Ravi Note]
Given below are some brilliant extracts from brilliant responses by Chiran Basnet, an Alike Sai school alumnus, a Sai university alumnus and a former Sri Sathya Sai Central Trust, Prasanthi Nilayam employee, to a Madhu Baba devotee's arguments and questions put up by Shubha Ramesh Kumar as a post here: https://www.facebook.com/notes/shubha-ramesh-kumar/alumni-for-swami-vs-alumni-for-madhusudhan-naidu/1362682843777532, dated April 5th 2017
[In response to Madhu Baba devotee (MBD) comment about Swami having said in public discourses in 2005 and 2007 that he would go on world tour and Sri Lanka, respectively:]
Chiran Basnet: Swami said many things in His life time. Always Divine though He interacted and entertained devotees with His Human Nature that was source of Immense connection, joy and humour. Mudenahalli believers’ permanent narrative is a blind belief that if some of those things He said didn’t happen, then all things said and done by Sai are questionable. I remember their arguments of He said 96 years which did not happen so what He said about 'No Intermediaries' can be 'Yes Intermediaries' too! This is their essential logic in the creation of ‘out of nowhere subtle concepts’. Seems like they will do the business of all those unfulfilled promises. That remains their Business USP.
I remember Swami telling Nepalese devotees that He will come to Nepal and give Darshan in Pashupathi Nath Temple. Those memories and words give great joy till date. So, what if it did not happen? Rather we rejoice in those temporary happy Blessings of Sai than lose faith egged on by our monkey mind.
Swami said I am like a child among children …. Most of us have seen Him as Mother in His Divine interactions. Like a loving parent, He promised many things. A mother often says I will bring you that toy and never brings one. The child is delighted on that assurance. A mother’s intention is never to fool or disappoint her child and more so the Divine Mother who knows what benedictions should come our way. I pray that the subtle body followers get this important sense of a mother’s spirit of words spoken out of love and not instead readily view and brand the mother as a liar.
[In response to MBD: "Did donations to Central Trust define our relationship as Children of same Mother Sai? Did few dollars change our equation with each other?": ]
Chiran Basnet (slightly edited): Sri Sathya Sai central Trust is the labour of Love of our Sai in His Lifetime of which Sai was the soul and sole Trustee. Please show some respect and dignity to such a trust and not malign it’s honour with your cheap dollar values. Your abject stupidity has changed the equation not dollars. It may disappoint you to know that Sri Sathya Sai Central Trust requirements are fulfilled by His Love and Care till date and forever. They will never need to go around with begging bowls like the subtle folks. Your degrading reference to the trust and speaking like a third person also shows your ingratitude. Yours and mine education has been funded by the same Trust under Sai's aegis which you seek to address as an enemy entity today.
[In response to MBD comment about some celebrities visiting Muddenahalli group:]
Chiran (slightly edited): The celebrities, rich, famous and erstwhile few close devotee(s) seems to be the eternal trump card of the Muddenahalli following. They are here and therefore this is the truth is the regular discourse. The list now hilariously claims the honourable Prime Minister as their following which shows their level of desperation. You will mention Sri Ram Shetty but will conveniently forget to mention that his close relative Sri Narendranath Reddy (Chairman, SSIO) has condemned the Mudenahalli falsehood and disrespects to the Mahasamadhi.
I follow Sachin Tendulkar and Sunil Gavaskar in Twitter. I am their fan as much for their fame as their very human nature, same as you. Also, the other achievers you never failed to mention are illustrious people. But you forget that just because they are idols in their profession does not automatically make them spiritual giants and saints. But I guarantee you that a few minutes with Sri Pedda Reddy (the bare footed elephant caretaker guy) will be more enlightenment in Sai matters and Spirituality than all your list of celebrities. Please don’t mix up professional achievements and spiritual sense. In fact, they are usually cross (purposes) in life.
Looks like you have only Sri Ram Shetty, Sri Kishen Shingal in the other list. You forgot to add Mr Tigrett for once, I assure you there are hundreds of those in Sai's Life Time who have sacrificed their life's earnings at The Lotus Feet for their emancipations. How you wish you had them in your list too. Are all others not in your lists the unfortunate ones not to be called to subtle in spite of their great sacrifices and donations? Or the few you can name nullify all others’ contributions? And what is the logic here that they are great contributors and therefore subtle is true? No, those respected devotees are not seeking anything. You know the seekers of fame and infamy in Muddenahalli. Such egos have dragged these nice people into the subtle pit.
[In response to MBD comment alleging hate-filled campaign against Muddenahalli group:]
Chiran Basnet (slightly edited): There is no hate filled social media campaign. There are only facts based on Swami’s life and teachings that completely negates subtle claims and phenomena. Please get this essential fact right. The social media campaign or whatever you call is not attack but spontaneous reactions of defense. The attack in the first place is by you the subtle folks. You have mocked, dismantled and sold the very pristine life and teachings of our Sai. You attacked our simple beliefs in Sai and His words and His Teaching by propagating fraudulent subtle phenomena. You went about like corporates with its well-oiled machinery to propagate Your theories everywhere. We are only defending our simple beliefs and faith in Sai Words that your propagation tries to belittle. Remember you and your subtle devotees (are) going around the town (saying) that Puttaparthi is kindergarten and Mudenahalli is higher learnings? That those who go to Puttaparthi are low level and not beckoned for higher level? You sound unnecessarily victimized!
[In response to MBD comment: Ask any of the elders, did Swami even for once, say “Go, Fight, Expose and Come Back”? I bet you wouldn’t find a single person saying a Yes! That’s why Swami gave us an alternative approach – He says, “Avoid Bad Company”. HE says, “treat such people as cheats”. He says, “Even if you can’t oblige, speak obligingly”:]
Chiran Basnet: Your selective half quotes of Swami shows how far everything gets used to suit subtle purpose. You did put ‘treat such people as cheats’ only. Here is the full quote for your reference: “People say 'Baba appeared to me in a dream and commanded me to do this and that, to you, to collect so much from you etc., etc. Do not give heed to such cheats; punish them in the way they deserve. That is the advice I have to give you.” (SSS 5.20: March 29, 1965)
You conveniently forgot to include “punish them in the way they deserve. That is the advice I have to give you.” The best reference to Sai's guidance is the numerous volumes of Satya Sai Speaks. No need to ask anyone. Apart from saying speak obligingly He also said “punish them in the way they deserve. That is the advice I have to give you.” You asked for one reference unaware that there are many references. More references below: “Do not believe if any one comes to you and declares, "Sathya Sai Baba came to me in my dream and commissioned me to do publicity for him. Please help me as far as you can". I do not commission any one for such work, either in dream or while he is awake. Such men are cheats; treat them as such, without mercy.” (SSS 05.15: March 26, 1965)
“There is another set of people who trade on your faith. They advertise that I am 'talking' through a medium or some other thing. Treat all such people and their agents or brokers as you treat cheats; if you do not treat them so, then you are also accomplices in the cheating process. “SSS 2.51: November 25, 1962
"Persons who claim to be possessed by Me have appeared recently; order them out, wherever you meet them. Do not yield to such morons and fakes, and lower your own dignity as devotees". (Sathyam Sivam Sundaram Volume 2, p.202)
I hope you get the tone of Sai when He says unequivocally, “punish them in the way they deserve. That is the advice I have to give you”, “Such men are cheats; treat them as such, without mercy” as well as “ Treat all such people and their agents or brokers as you treat cheats; if you do not treat them so, then you are also accomplices in the cheating process.”
[About MBD comment advising against criticism:]
Chiran Basnet: ...
If criticism of others reaches the Lord what about the mockery of Sai’s Action, His Life Time Teachings and of course the disrespect to Mahasamadhi post Avatar hood?
From our end there is no criticism but valid questions raised on Muddenahalli subtle claims purely based on the Words and cautions of Sai. Since no valid answers were ever given to genuine queries, the criticism and abuse started with opening of dozens of fake fb trolls trying to silence us. Your Facebook friends Mervyn Hughes, Venkatesh Babu and their ilk hide behind fake fb page and have regularly abused Sai devotees as whore, bastard, Puttaparthi Parasites, racist slur , defamatory accusations and what not? I don’t remember seeing your great quotations anywhere to remind Sai's conduct and dignity to your good friends whose Facebook pages you keep visiting. They, your fake Facebook subtle trolls are responsible for today’s degrading dialogue in social media. Please take your knowledge of Sanskrit verses to where it is most required. How selective of you to view their action as Dharmic war and ours as Adharmic conduct?
We are not barking up the wrong tree but simply checking on the pest and rodents that try to eat of the very roots of the magnificent Sai Tree that provides one and all with healing fruit, rejuvenating cool shade and assuring canopy of hope and succor. Swami's words: “In this Kali Yuga, also such imitations are cropping up just as Paundraka shaped himself into a Vasudeva (Krishna). We have today even Sathya Sai Babas… they study photographs and hold their hands up very nearly like I do and make themselves ridiculous by frantic attempts to imitate Me. They forget that imitation is only human; but, Creation is Divine.
Those who attempt to become Sathya Sai Babas by this ludicrous process of imitation only destroy whatever faith some people have placed in the Divine. They are POISONOUS PESTS which injure the peace and harmony of society. They collect around themselves insects of like nature. For only birds of the same feather can flock together. These 'pretenders' fall into ruin themselves and bring ruin on the society where they operate, as the proverbial horde of monkeys that ruin themselves and bring ruin on the forest which they inhabit.” (SSS 12.2: January 14, 1973)
[In response to MBD comment extolling Muddenahalli group service activities of schools and hospitals:]
Chiran Basnet (has one paragraph view of mine - Ravi - clearly indicated):
Since every defense of Muddenahalli subtle form ends in their followers inevitably and vociferously saying’ we are building schools and hospitals’ I wish to deal with the Seva front thoroughly. You and Muddenahalli groups are not the only one aware of and focusing on the evil of society such as poverty , illiteracy etc.
Here is Bala Sai Baba on the same note. “Sri Bala sai Baba’s task of uplifting humanity is undertaken through the centers already established in several countries around the world. The programs organized by Baba’s Trust can be classified into three wings: spiritual, educational and service. Spiritual activities consist of singing Bhajans, meditation, and the promotion of universal brotherhood and harmony amongst the people by the celebration of holy festivals of all the faiths. Educational activities, on the other hand, include the imparting and spreading of human values through classes designed for children of all ages. In Baba’s educational institutions, secular and spiritual education is designed to develop a complete personality. Balasai institutions are held as models for education, service and spiritual work in many countries around the world. Last but not least, service activities include service to the sick, aged, handicapped, and feeding the poor.
The Trust operates one clinic where 100 to 150 out-patients are treated daily, and where the poor can obtain treatment, medicines and injections, all free of charge. The Trust has conducted many health camps in Allopathic medicine, Naturopathy and Acupressure, and is a pioneer in conducting eye camps. More than 55,700 cataract and I.O.L (Intra Ocular Lens) operations have been performed. Ours is the first Charitable Trust to conducted I.O.L operations in rural areas. The Trust is also making many efforts to promote both Polio and AIDS awareness campaigns.”
Here is Sanjay Baba on the same note: ‘Love all serve all, he says Baba leads by example as He has adopted many villages on the outskirts of Kathmandu, with the programme aimed at reducing malnutrition, poverty, upliftment of physical health through medical facilities and providing spiritual livelihood through value education. Baba’s vision is to see the Ashram as a socio-educational, spiritual, cultural culmination.’
Every one of them have a seva front to use as their vital defense. They indeed do Seva too. So, should we accept them all as our Sathya Sai Baba of Puttaparthi?
What (is) the important guidance of Swami on Seva? Swami says: “The Organisations named after Me are not to be used for publicizing My name or creating a new cult around My worship. They must render sevā (selfless service) to the helpless, the sick, the distressed, the illiterate and the needy. Their sevā should not be exhibitionistic. It must seek no reward, not even gratitude or thanks from the recipients. Sevā is sādhanā (spiritual discipline) not a pastime of the rich and well-placed. Each one must realise his or her own truth. That is the purpose of all the teaching, all the curing, all the counseling, all the organising, all the advising that I do.” (SSS 8.6: February 23, 1968)
It is not merely the service that counts but how the course of service is dharmic.
“Sathya, Dharma, Shanthi, Prema and Ahimsa are in us like the paṇcha prāñas (five vital airs). We think that the five prāñas (prāña, apāna, uḍāna, samāna and vyāna) are protecting this body. But it is Truth, Right Conduct, Love, Peace and Non-violence which give real happiness to the body. These are the real paṇcha prāñas. In no circumstances should these five vital principles be departed from or given up. Render service to society with these principles in your mind and with broad-minded dedication to the wellbeing of all. That alone will please Sai.” (SSS 18.22: November 17, 1985)
Please note the above Swami’s vital guidance on seva . The seva must have basis on Sathya and Dharma before anything.
[Ravi comment: I personally have no objection to Bala Sai Baba and Sanjay Sai Baba activities in terms of any negative impact on Sathya Sai movement, as Bala Sai Baba and Sanjay Sai Baba are doing these activities in their own name, and so are NOT, at least directly, diluting and corrupting the legacy of Bhagavan Sri Sathya Sai Baba. I think I will have no objection to Muddenahalli group activities if they rename their institutions as Madhu Baba institutions and trusts, and broadcast and publish the words and activities of Madhusudan Naidu as Madhu Baba words & activities (NOT Sri Sathya Sai Baba words & activities). end-Ravi-comment]...
Who is our ideal for Seva, who is Our Hero and guide? Swamy says:
"You can observe Me and My activities; note how I adhere to righteousness, moral order, truth and universal compassion. That is what I desire you to learn from Me. Many of you plead for a 'Message' from Me, to take to the Samithi (Sai centre) of which you are members. Well, My life is My message. You will be adhering to My message if you so live that your lives are evidence of the dispassionate quiet, the courage, the confidence, the eagerness to serve those who are in distress, that My life inspires you with." - From Bhagawan’s Discourse on the occasion of World Conference of Sri Sathya Sai Seva Organisations, in Mumbai, on 17th May, 1968. Reference: "Sathya Sai Speaks", Vol.- VIII, Chapter-19. Page: 96-97
The conduct of Mudenahalli service and basis does not match the essential guidance of Sai which has basis on Sathya and Dharma. Neither they come within His guidance of funding for seva. It has all the elements of what Swami disassociates seva with when He says, “The Organizations named after Me are not to be used for publicizing My name or creating a new cult around My worship.”
What does Swami Himself (say) about people asking for money in His name?
There are some people who are doing business in the Name of Sai. They are cheating others, pretending to be devotees of Sai. I do not approve of such behaviour. They are not devotees at all. They are going to different parts of the country and also abroad to make money in the name of Sai. It is a big crime. I do not ask for even a single paisa from others. I never approve of such business. Whoever it may be, if somebody approaches you with such a crass motive, tell him to get out at once. Do not allow business to enter the field of spirituality. SSS 35.11: 22 July, 2002
What Mudenahalli had achieved and done in few years in their seva front is undoubtedly phenomenal. I assure you, however, the sum total of Muddenhalli achievements still don't match a few projects by Swami in His Life time. Neither the sum total of their current and future project will match His entire life Seva projects. Important to note is that neither the combined projects of Mudenahalli and Puttaparthi will match the Service activities of many other service Trusts worldwide. So, what was all the pain of Avatarhood and Now subtle hood when God's service activities (as projected to be the mission of Avatar by Subtle) at the most is second best in the world? Surely, He took pains for much more than this? However, still if all that has been done by Muddenahalli was achieved by the mentors without objectionable ideals that is antithesis of Sai’s guidance, am sure they would have been legends in Sai worlds and Society.
It is essential to understand the spirit and purpose of seva as extolled by Swami. Swami has summarized seva as “ It is not what you do as seva, It is what seva does to you”. What He essentially meant is the energy and vibe a superior dharmic selfless seva brings about in individual and Society at large. Seva not only improves the situation of the beneficiary but primarily helps the spiritual progress of the benefactor and improves the good energy of the environment and the world we live in. Therefore, it is not merely the size and grandeur of seva that makes it worthwhile. It has to fulfill the essential conduct and basis of seva to make its larger purpose of goodness manifest. As much as we see the seva of Muddenahalli benefit others we are also assured that since such seva doesn’t match the guidelines of Sai they will be merely viewed as larger nefarious purpose to destroy and dismantle the spirit of Sai's world.
The kind of extraordinary split , extreme hatred amongst erstwhile Sai fraternity, the nervousness and confusion that permeates Sai world due to the subtle phenomena and so on are only the beginning of the mission of whoever that guides the Muddenahalli mentors .
Whoever thought I would counter my Sai brother this way? Whoever thought the tyagajeevis in selfless friendship and servitude to Sai for over 5 decades would be enemies degrading one another. Alike and Muddenahalli separation can never be the work of Sai , neither the animosity amongst the tyagajeevis. Neither the separation of Muddenahalli from Sai's trust at Puttaparthi would be His efforts. More so, families have been separated on the beliefs and nonbelief of the subtle phenomena. Few of our erstwhile best alumni friends don't see eye to eye these days. Devotees are criticizing and hating one another based on their respective camps. It is a crime to associate such vertical split, unease and animosity on Sai, who always spoke of unity, love and respect amongst us.
As a powerful Poorna Avatar leaves the body, the various lower energies suppressed by His sheer Physical presence (rise) up to gain their grounds. More often than not like a trojan virus they spring from within and destroy your essential functions and basics. If the one that runs Mudenahalli is not Sai, which am sure is not our Sai , then it’s intentions and destructions will be way brutal than the measurable service they claim today.
More important is to note that the mission of Sai was not building of schools and hospitals. Frankly then, as I said, it should be the greatest service organisation in terms of service rendered in the world. But we aren’t. Neither we will be if you include current and future service activity too. A Warren Buffet, Mark Zuckerberg and Bill Gates have committed more dollars in service projects than we can dream of. Especially in this case their own hard earned money without begging involved . If Sai Missions and Sai is to be judged by Seva then we may as well say those above guys as incarnations of Brahma, Vishnu and Maheshwara.
Swami’s says: And even before your Bhakthi (devotion) ripens, you strive to lead others, you collect donations and subscriptions and plan mandirs (temples) and sangams (associations); all this is mere show, which brings spiritual loss, rather than spiritual gain. When you start publicity, you descend to the level of those who compete in collecting clientele, decrying others and extolling themselves. Where money is calculated and garnered, and exhibited to demonstrate one's achievements, I will not be present. I come only where sincerity, faith and surrender are valued." - Bhagawan Baba’s Discourse on 15th Oct 1964, Prasanthi Nilayam Reference: "Sathya Sai Speaks", Vol. - IV, Chapter - 35. Page: 210
Remember the story Swami Says of a foolish Saint? As the saint was walking an elephant comes the opposite way. The mahout on the elephant shouts continually to this saint to give away. The saint thinks , ' if the elephant can trample me God would say so ' and continues to walk the path only to be trampled by the elephant. In heaven he complains to God ' the elephant was going to kill me , why didn't you caution ? ' God say ‘picchi wada what was the frantic shouting of mahout to give way, I was shouting’.
Swami does not have to appear or give akashvani to say Muddenahalli subtle phenomena is fraud. His words and caution are numerous on this agenda as unequivocal fraud. We are shouting like a mahout for those who care to hear. I have no objection to those who have been guided to keep silence on Muddenahalli issue.
But no one has the right to say we have not been prodded to speak by our inner voices too. I always think how many animals, birds and humans must have seen Ravana taking Mother Sita on pushpaka vimana up in the air. Some were uninterested . Still some might have thought this is Divine drama and said to them,' who do I think I am, do I need to defend the embodiment of Maha Shakthi herself in Mother Sita? Or am I so great that the consort of Lord of the Universe need my assistance here?" Fair enough if such wisdom stopped them from taking on Ravana.
The point is I have not seen any verses in Ramayana by either Valmiki or Tuslisidas or others that call Jatayu an idiot for thinking too much of itself. Did they say or did Rama say,' oh foolish bird, why u had to get killed , you deserve this death for over assumptions!' ? No. In fact Rama gives water to Jatayu who leaves prana in the Lord’s embrace. I believe Ramayana has more verses extolling the birds and animals including monkeys and squirrels than human beings who assisted the Lord in whatever capacity they could.
Sai does not need assistance as much as Lord Rama didn't. If I cannot be Hanuman or Jatayu, I will pride myself having done squirrel 's job.
The purpose of all spiritual sadhana is purity and thereby self-realization. The purpose of sadhana is not to be medium like Madhu. Here I don't put Swami's words because I do not know which one to pick from thousands of discourses which He speaks on purpose of human life and sadhana. In fact He drew all of us for that message of self-emancipations which is the mission of Avatar. Not to build only schools and hospitals as you seem to put Avataric mission in a nutshell.
Finally, hypothetically, suppose Muddenhalli subtle phenomena is true. The questions to be asked is does the subtle phenomena adhere to His righteous ways and His dictum ' My Life is My Message '? Then where do we stand with all this relentless hammering of the phenomena? How will we face the Lord, How will we answer Him? No worries there. Believe me for the first time He will be facing us and our questions! What are the questions, nay grudges?
How come those who lived by the simplicity of your implicit message and teachings are the one who have been blinded? How come those devotees, ladies, gents, couples who served you and still in servitude of lifetime are the unfortunate ones who cannot be part of your further mission. How come hundreds of students (single and some retired now) who left every aspiration and engagements of life including families are the ones who are still impure enough to recognize your subtle form? How come the hundreds of elderly ladies, some in servitude for 50 years, some bed ridden, some still putting flowers around your doors are saying, ‘ayyo Muddenhalli ghor papam (the Mudenahalli happening is absolute sin) ' made to do such blasphemy at their deathbed? The questions are unending ....
--- end extracts from https://www.facebook.com/notes/shubha-ramesh-kumar/alumni-for-swami-vs-alumni-for-madhusudhan-naidu/1362682843777532 ---
Ravi: As a former teacher of the Sai university, Prasanthi Nilayam campus (free service from Jan. 2003 to Mar. 2012 with designations of Honorary Staff, Honorary Faculty and Visiting Faculty), I congratulate and thank Sai university alumnus and former Sri Sathya Sai Central Trust employee, Chiran Basnet for these well researched (from Swami discourse quotes perspective), spiritually knowledgeable and spiritually intuitive, and quite well worded responses to Madhu Baba devotee arguments & questions. I think Chiran Basnet has done a great service to Sai university alumni who are loyal to Prasanthi Nilayam and Bhagavan's teachings & instructions to his devotees, by speaking up in such a brilliant manner. Let us pray to Bhagavan that more such alumni will be inspired by Chiran's brilliant work here, and do their duty to Bhagavan to safeguard Bhagavan's legacy and memory from being diluted, distorted and corrupted by Madhu Baba and his devotees.
In response to the above paragraph as my comment on above mentioned Facebook post, Chiran Basnet responded:Thanks to sister Shubha Ramesh Kumar for putting up the post.
Thank you for your kind words Sir, you have inspired many incl. myself to fight this fraud, Sairam
Ravi: I Facebook-liked the above response-comment.
[I thank Shri Chiran Basnet and have presumed that he will not have any objections to me sharing the above extracts from his responses put up on above mentioned Facebook post, on this post which is freely viewable by all, and does not have any financial profit motive whatsoever.]